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Messages - Leggy

Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 [6] 7 8 9 10 11 ... 38
76
General Discussion / Re: Anthony Taylor (Newcastle vs Liverpool)
« on: Sun 19 Feb 2023 19:14 »
The problem with cautions / send offs in cup competitions only resulting in suspensions in the same competition is that a player in a team that is losing a cup-tie can commit misconduct safe in the knowledge that any suspension will be served next season (if at all).  Its a "free-hit" and, unfortunate that it is for the Newcastle 'keeper, thems the breaks (as one of our recent ex-PMs said).

77
I Spy Old Refs! / Re: Football League Linesmen 1985-86 - First Names?
« on: Sun 19 Feb 2023 19:03 »
Quote from: Acme Thunderer on Sun 19 Feb 2023 16:37
Quote from: Leggy on Mon 13 Feb 2023 17:14
OK - here goes, any where I am not 100% certain have "??" at the end:-

94 - Basil Baker.
97 - Graham Bargery ??
117 - Michael (Mike) Bullivent - later FL Ref.
146 - Graham Crafter - later became something big in Korfball officiating.
147 - Vernon Crew.
151 - Philip (Phil) Crossley - later FL Ref.
158 - Derek Daughtery.
161 - Alan Dawson ??
164 - Philip (Phil) Don - later FL and FIFA Ref.
179 - W A (Tony) Flood ??.
180 - Peter Foakes - later FL Ref and father to England wicket-keeper Ben.
181 - Philip (Phil) Forsdick ??
182 - David (Dave) Frampton - later FL Ref.
190 - Emerson Griffith - a trail blazer for black Football League officials.
201 - Paul (T P) Healy.
202 - Peter (Pete) Helsby ??
203 - Colin Henderson.
241 - David Keen.
255 - Stuart Louden ??
259 - David (Dave) Madgwick ??
269 - James (Jim) McMenamin.
278 - Kelvin Morton - later FL Ref.
280 - A P (Tony) Murphy) ??
290 - E J (Jim / James) Parker - later FL Ref.
294 - Roger Pawley - later FL Ref.
295 - Colin Peake.
299 - Ronald (Ron) Pearl ??
300 - Geoffrey (Geoff)  Pearson - later FL Ref ??
310 - Barry Priest ??
311 - Christopher (Chris) Proud.
329 - Richard Saunders.
330 - Paul Scoble - later FL Ref.
333 - David (Dave) - Shadwell ??
340 - A W S (Arthur) Smith - later FL Ref and General Secretary of the Referees' Association.
353 - Michael (Mike) Taylor ??
361 - Michael (Mike) Topping ??
369 - Michael (Mick) Vigus.
276 - Keith Wenham.
285 - A C (Tony) Williams.

300 Geoffrey 'Geoff' Pearson, agreed yes, another Surrey colleague in former days. However, he did not get on to the referees list and I'm wondering whether you're thinking of Roger Pearson of Peterlee who did make it on to the list.

You are, of course, right.  Its not a conflation of Pearsons, just a failing of (one's own) memory.

78
General Discussion / Re: Anthony Taylor (Newcastle vs Liverpool)
« on: Sun 19 Feb 2023 10:39 »
Disappointed (but not surprised) to hear Eddie Howe saying it was probably the right decision but he did not know the Law on handball.  He is only the coach of the fourth best football team in the country, perhaps his employers do not require him to know the laws / rules of the game he works in??

79
General Discussion / Re: A TAYLOR: ARSENAL V M CITY
« on: Thu 16 Feb 2023 18:26 »
Quote from: TheThingFromLewes on Wed 15 Feb 2023 20:19
I think he’s been superb in a highly charged atmosphere and game.

This is the first game since Webb had called the meeting of all SG1 officials and the early stamping out of time wasting with a card in the first half hour or so looks like a possible result of such discussions.

Will be interesting to see if that measure is continued into the weekend.


After the early caution for time wasting, I wondered out loud if this had almost given Ederson a free-pass to push his luck with time wasting.  The odds of a referee at this level giving a goal-keeper (or any player) two yellow cards for time wasting are higher than of me winning the lottery jackpot (and I do not play the lottery!!

80
General Discussion / Re: R JONES: M CITY V A VILLA
« on: Thu 16 Feb 2023 18:22 »
Quote from: Failed Ref on Thu 16 Feb 2023 06:10
Yes, they do. I watched Burnley v Watford and an incident at a corner was farcical with players falling around, grappling and feigning injury. FA should have charged both teams for failing to control their players! Embarrassing. Player behaviour now is horrendous.

Maybe we do not help ourselves when we have referees reminding players:
~ Not to grapple at a corner kick,
~ Not to encroach at a penalty kick.
~ Where to stand (as a goal-keeper) at a penalty kick.
etc.

We should not be undertaking basic law instruction mid-game with top level professional footballers.  Perhaps the referee should confirm with the manager / captain before the game that the players know the Laws of the game and then - during the game - apply them.  Just a thought.


81
Cup Appointments / Re: EFL Cup [Carabao Cup] - 2022/2023
« on: Thu 16 Feb 2023 18:19 »
Quote from: jacksamuel21 on Wed 15 Feb 2023 00:06
Dear Dear what a shocking appointment. Both the VAR official and the referee are dreadful. In all honesty I hope they have a shocker.

Hooper/ Madley deserve it far more.

I 100% agree it is a poor appointment, but I think that wishing that someone "has a shocker" is less than kind, and unwarranted.

82
General Discussion / Re: Webb Calls emergency meeting
« on: Mon 13 Feb 2023 17:31 »
I wonder if a dispassionate cost:benefit analysis of VAR in the EPL was undertaken whether it would be seen to be value for money.

A lot of money has been spent and the error count is marginally down, but expectations (however unrealistic) were much higher than that.  We still have the situation whereby there are discussions, arguments and disagreements post-games and decisions.

We really have not progressed (especially on offside and handball) over the last ten or twenty years. 

I suspect that the verdict would be that value for money has not been achieved.

83
I Spy Old Refs! / Re: Football League Linesmen 1985-86 - First Names?
« on: Mon 13 Feb 2023 17:14 »
OK - here goes, any where I am not 100% certain have "??" at the end:-

94 - Basil Baker.
97 - Graham Bargery ??
117 - Michael (Mike) Bullivent - later FL Ref.
146 - Graham Crafter - later became something big in Korfball officiating.
147 - Vernon Crew.
151 - Philip (Phil) Crossley - later FL Ref.
158 - Derek Daughtery.
161 - Alan Dawson ??
164 - Philip (Phil) Don - later FL and FIFA Ref.
179 - W A (Tony) Flood ??.
180 - Peter Foakes - later FL Ref and father to England wicket-keeper Ben.
181 - Philip (Phil) Forsdick ??
182 - David (Dave) Frampton - later FL Ref.
190 - Emerson Griffith - a trail blazer for black Football League officials.
201 - Paul (T P) Healy.
202 - Peter (Pete) Helsby ??
203 - Colin Henderson.
241 - David Keen.
255 - Stuart Louden ??
259 - David (Dave) Madgwick ??
269 - James (Jim) McMenamin.
278 - Kelvin Morton - later FL Ref.
280 - A P (Tony) Murphy) ??
290 - E J (Jim / James) Parker - later FL Ref.
294 - Roger Pawley - later FL Ref.
295 - Colin Peake.
299 - Ronald (Ron) Pearl ??
300 - Geoffrey (Geoff)  Pearson - later FL Ref ??
310 - Barry Priest ??
311 - Christopher (Chris) Proud.
329 - Richard Saunders.
330 - Paul Scoble - later FL Ref.
333 - David (Dave) - Shadwell ??
340 - A W S (Arthur) Smith - later FL Ref and General Secretary of the Referees' Association.
353 - Michael (Mike) Taylor ??
361 - Michael (Mike) Topping ??
369 - Michael (Mick) Vigus.
276 - Keith Wenham.
285 - A C (Tony) Williams.

84
General Discussion / Re: The VAR thread
« on: Sun 05 Feb 2023 11:21 »
Quote from: Carter on Sat 04 Feb 2023 19:56
Quote from: ajb95 on Sat 04 Feb 2023 18:42
Is VAR intervening on ball in and out of play now, it hasn’t been in previous years? @newcastle v West Ham

Yes because its a matter of fact, its already happened on a game this season I seem to remember.


But surely it can only intervene in relation to one of the four categories for which VAR is used?  It would not intervene on an incorrect line decision that does not revolve around a goal, penalty kick, red card or case of mistaken identity (although I am struggling to think of a case where that could happen!).

85
General Discussion / Re: P TIERNEY - Newcastle v Southampton (EFL)
« on: Wed 01 Feb 2023 17:22 »
Quote from: RCG on Wed 01 Feb 2023 07:16
"Why wasn't there a further card for Guimares after having been shown the RC as he obviously said something to Tierney given Tierney's facial stunned reaction?"

Anything he said can be reported but I dont think you can be shown another card after a red?


Let's hope that it was reported and an additional ban follows.  Having said that; and given the current approach to "managing (=tolerating and tacitly encouraging) such situations, I am not holding my breath for this to happen.

PS:  It should not have needed VAR to point out to an SG1 referee that an act of SFP had taken place some 5-10 yards in front of his unobscructued view.

86
General Discussion / Re: Twente v. Feyenoord
« on: Tue 31 Jan 2023 18:41 »
The fact that he missed is a comment on the accuracy of his throwing but an irrelevance as to whether it is VC or not.  If I throw a punch at an opponent and miss, that is still VC.

He could not have used any more force in using the ball as a weapon than he did.  Throwing it into the ground is petulant and warrants a yellow card.  Aiming it at an opponent (even a stupid one) with the level of firce used can be classed as VC.

87
General Discussion / Re: Charlton v Bolton The Babbling Brook
« on: Tue 31 Jan 2023 18:32 »
Quote from: Observeref8 on Tue 31 Jan 2023 00:21
His definitely from st Leonard’s on sea in Hastings (Sussex) nice guy tbf lined to him 3/4 times when he was L3

Blimey, I must be older than I thought.  Carl lined to me several times between 1998 and 2005.

88
General Discussion / Re: Twente v. Feyenoord
« on: Mon 30 Jan 2023 17:39 »
Understandable annoyance, but also violent conduct.  Using the ball as a missile can be classed as VC.

89
General Discussion / Re: T NIELD - Bolton v FGR
« on: Mon 30 Jan 2023 17:32 »
Perhaps views of pitch "quality" will vary according to age?  For those who remember the ploughed fields and beaches of the 70s will judge most pitches in January 2023 to be like Wembley.  Younger correspondents used to pitches of billiard table quality will have a more critical eye.

90
General Discussion / Re: David Coote- Brighton vs Liverpool
« on: Mon 30 Jan 2023 17:24 »
Quote from: Whistleblower on Mon 30 Jan 2023 10:09
Quote from: cwh on Sun 29 Jan 2023 17:38
As soon as I saw this thread I thought 'oh no' not another 'Coote bashing' and sure enough it has been apart from one posting? - I presume that everyone complaining thinks they can do better or could have done better when they were referees if indeed they were/are - surely if he is that bad he would be removed from the list but he  has not - so is it always necessary to always be so negative all the time


cwh raises an interesting and important point in writing " surely if he is that bad he would be removed from the list but he has not ".  My conviction is that Coote is not up to what one might reasonably expect to be SG1 standard but indeed he is still there and getting quite prestigious appointments from time to time though it should be noted he was asked to relinquish his FIFA badge and has done so. I have little doubt that he will be rewarded with a Cup Final sometime .

What is the explanation? Possibly the powers that be do consider him to be of SG1 standard. With Riley in charge I could see that because Coote is a referee in the Riley mould. With Webb we shall wait and see. Or perhaps there are not enough promising referees coming up through the ranks to fill the SG1 and so some of the 'lesser' practitioners retain their places. Whether Coote's employment with various County FAs has any relevance is perhaps an explanation but can only be informed speculation. Certainly, there has been an 'old pals network' running in the FA Referees Department for years and years but whether Coote is a beneficiary of that I have no way of knowing.

I think Coote is a perfectly reasonable FL referee but no more than that but like most of us here on RTR, our opinion counts for diddly squat in the real world of referee promotions and retentions.


It is easy for anyone (including us) to say that so-and-so is not up to SG1 standard and should be removed.  But anyone removed will need to be replaced (indeed, given the need to fill 4O and VAR duties there is a strong argument for a larger SG1 list) and replacements will need to be willing and capable to step up. 

Some of the capable are not willing and many of the willing are not capable.

This is why the SG1 list is not as stuffed with as much quality as it needs - and has had in the past.

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