RateTheRef

Quote from: jacksamuel21 on Sat 20 May 2023 19:41

Liverpool vs Villa has seen some dreadful referee performances in the last few seasons.

Moss @Villa Park Last Season
Attwell @Anfield Last Year
Atkinson and Tierney both had poor performances in 2020 too

Its one of those games like Spurs vs Chelsea and Liverpool vs Spurs.



I just don't see how Konsa didn't deliberately play it, he clearly moves his leg

Quote from: Scally Bob on Sat 20 May 2023 18:37

Quote from: rustyref on Sat 20 May 2023 18:23

Quote from: Scally Bob on Sat 20 May 2023 18:19

Quote from: Adam on Sat 20 May 2023 15:27

That is an absolutely brilliant on field call to give Villa a penalty. My whole house watching and the whole of Anfield thought Konate won the ball but he hadn't. Great work!

In my seat at Anfield I and everybody around me knew it was a penalty and our only complaint was Konate’s poor positioning which caused him to make a rash challenge.

When did referees start going to the monitor to check offsides? I must have missed that update.

When it isn't black and white and there has to be a subjective decision made as to whether the player had interfered with play or an opponent.  Has happened a few times.

As I was at the game I’ll see what the television shows me. I’d be interested to see what excuse was concocted for the SFP by Mings.

I hope Mr. Webb is going to instruct his charges to deal with timewasting properly as well. Not quite as bad as Newcastle but atrocious nonetheless. The Villa goalkeeper was wasting time from the start, why wait 76 minutes to apply Law? The blizzard of late yellows for Villa was pointless-do it earlier.

They Yellow Card for Martinez was pointless. He was never going to get a second yellow no longer how much time he took.

He’d still have been criticised for not booking him though.

The late, token caution for time wasting is 100% ineffective - mostly because everyone (including the time-waster) knows that no referee is going to make the headlines by issuing a second yellow card for the same time-wasting, however justified.

There needs to be a different sanction - one that impacts the team wasting time at the time that it happens.

On a similar theme, no referee is going to penalise a goal-keeper for exceeding the permitted six seconds while holding the ball.  Part of the reason for this (which I get) is that organising an indirect free-kick in the defending penalty area is a nightmare and to be avoided at all costs.  But when we see goal-keepers "using" upwards of 25 seconds before releasing the ball into play something really does need to be done as 25 seconds is 0.5% of a full 90 minutes ..... do that four times in a game and you have chopped off 2% out of the game.  Perhaps if fans were given a 2% refund on their admission fees and (more significantly) TV companies given a 2% refund on their fees it might motivate the teams, leagues and governing bodies to do something about it.

(EDIT- I presume this was meant to be your comment, please make sure you use the quote box correctly)

I note that - on the BBC Sport site - Howard Webb is quoted as saying that the behaviour of those in the technical area has not been good enough and he is working with "stakeholders" to implement an improvement over the summer so that - next season - there is an improvement.  While he on the case, Howard can implement the following seven-point plan to make football a better experience for those who play, coach, watch and officiate:


1. Handball
 
In an attempt to reach the promised land of 100% clarity has only resulted in less clarity.  You now have cases where the same incident is treated differently depending on whether it is a defender or an attacker who (allegedly) commits an offence and where that offence occurs.  We need to move away from "body shape"; the "silhouette” nonsense and decide whether the player (i) meant to handle or (ii) benefited from accidentally handling the ball - and penalise accordingly.


2. Offside

The geometry part is OK (as long as the VAR does their line drawing diligently); but the offside offence part has also been made less clear in an attempt to reach that elusive promised land of 100% clarity.  The decision on whether or not an offence has occurred should revert to the previous wording and interpretation (interfering with play, players or seeking to gain an advantage).  Both handball and offside will have elements of subjectivity but attempts to remove this have failed and we should just trust the referee’s (or assistant referee’s) subjective judgement.


3.  Faking it

Players at the top level are clearly shameless as they routinely and frequently exaggerate (or completely fake) serious injury purely for the purpose of getting an opponent into trouble.  It is clear from the subsequent play that they all have the Lazarus gene in terms of their recovery.  This is really unappealing and can quickly be eliminated by the strict implementation of post-match sanctions.  One match ban for the first offence, increased each time for a subsequent offence.  It will keep someone busy on a Monday morning, but only for a few weeks.


4. Gamesmanship at penalty kicks.

This is now endemic.  Players question the initial award, they then question the VAR review, the goal-keeper messes with the penalty mark and the penalty-taker’s head.  Add to this the time that the referee spends telling everyone what they can / cannot do (its in the Laws folks!) and three / four minutes can easily elapse between the award and the penalty actually being taken …… and then there is the goal celebration.  Penalty kicks should become “stand alone” events (a la hockey or as in a penalty shoot-out) – there would be no encroachment, no gamesmanship and 99% less aggravation.  The outcome would be either a goal or a goal-kick.


5. Time wasting

The ideal answer to this is two 30-minute “ball in play” halves, and a trial of that is long overdue.  If that is too radical, then a few simple actions will help:
•   Either abolish the “six-second” rule or enforce it (preferably enforce it).
•   Allow a throw-in to be reversed if it is not taken promptly.
•   Change a goal-kick into a corner if it is not taken promptly.
•   Do not stop play is a player has a slightly poorly leg, sore arm or untied boot lace – no-one died because of that.  Their recovery will be speeded up by the game continuing around them.
•   Substituted players must leave by the shortest route, with the sanction for failing to act as directed by the referee being a one-minute delay in the substitute being allowed to enter the field of play.


6. Dissent and OFFINABUS

This is currently simply not enforced, so anything and everything has become acceptable.  Players can currently scream and shout at match officials, crowd around and harrangue them with pretty much 100% impunity.  This looks awful and has a real impact on player behaviour throughout the game.  It makes grass-roots referees less safe and at greater risk of verbal and physical assault and it has to change.  Showing the imaginary card also appears to be OK now because it is really (if ever) sanctioned.


7.  Technical Areas

Almost every manager / coach seems incapable of remaining within their Technical Area.  One remedy would be a mild electrical charge to “encourage” club officials to remain within bounds, but I suspect there may be objections to this.  More seriously, the players have GPS monitors to track their movement – club officials should also wear them, and a fine be imposed for each transgression.  They also need to behave much better – player take their lead from those in the Technical Area and the threshold for expulsion for poor behaviour should be much lower.


If football is serious about changing its image, then all of the above can be implemented at the start of next season.  It will need to backed-up with a steely determination to follow through and not wilt at the first cries of “its too severe and ruining the game” and the benefits will follow for everyone.  Just look at how Rugby Union is applying its new protocols for preventing in-game head injuries and follow suit.

This was a classic example of trying to "manage the game" and avoid early cards backfiring big time.

AM should have just refereed what was in front of him.  A yellow card for the first poor challenge was reasonable (although a red could have been justified).  Had that happened, there is a good chance that the retribution foul shortly after (which was also in the "orange" category) would not have happened.

After that he was always playing catch up and, sad to say, never really had the feel of the game.  A strong first ten / fifteen minutes might have enabled a decent game of football to break out - but that is not what the "product owners" want to see.

Excellent news!  I hope the 22 minutes added time did not cause the Jersey fans to miss the ferry home!

Quote from: Beacon on Fri 12 May 2023 19:41

The lack of Southern referees really does matter. How can our capital city not have had a SG1/ prem league referee for years. When was the last one? Alf  Buksh, Phil Don and Tony Ward? Norfolk I don’t think has had a football league referee since Jim Borrett. How can it be justified that we repeatedly transport refs all over the country for fourth official duties, which is shameful ecologically. Statistically the level of inequity is bewildering. Role models matter and the North/South split can not be justified. There must be bias in the system whether intentional or not and this is wrong.

Think that is just the nature of London.  There are lots of senior officials that refereed in London, but moved elsewhere before they made it to the top levels.  Lots of people move to London when they are young but then move away when they get a bit older and are looking to settle down and start a family, either because they don't want their kids being brought up in London schools or they just can't afford to buy a house there.

It is also inherently harder to be a senior referee in London as most people work in the city or West End and therefore can't drive to work.  Elsewhere in the country referees will drive straight to games from work, that isn't an option for most London based referees, and I know from my own experience it was a real problem.  I'd have to leave work very early to go home to get the car to then go to the game.

The standard of football that officials have to referee is also a factor. 

As does having a job with a County FA or the FA.

The very definition of a "character" who made refereeing in Jersey more entertaining and fun.  His only gripe was not always being able to plug in his hair-dryer in some of the Island's more "basic" referee changing facilities.

Soft, but he gave the referee a decision to make.  If VAR had been there it would not have intervened.