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Author Topic: Who was the referee? Appeals for information  (Read 6925 times)

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Acme Thunderer

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I suspect this is going to be v tricky to resolve. Gillingham were in Div 3 at the time, and as such, might have had a less experienced / short term Southern ref such as Powell, Weller or Wells in charge. Of the more experienced refs, only Callaghan (yes, he always looked quite young and petite), Bye and Roper come to mind. That assumes the ref came from a more southern location which I don't think always happened in those days, even for lower division matches. In other words, not a clue, sorry!

Edit - go with Aldous, as just suggested by the wise olddeagle

Acme Thunderer

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Not much to go on, but Ray Aldous (Ipswich) was dark haired and tall a bit like the gent pictured here.

Interestingly perhaps, according to a local newspaper article, Ray Aldous refereed the Gills v Watford game on 18/9/65 and awarded Gills a penalty after Yeo was sent flying in the penalty area. Could this be the incident and Mr Aldous is just about to point rather dramatically, Dean-esque style, to the penalty spot?   :o

Whistleblower

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One has to go on clues. This referee is wearing his shirt sleeves rolled, not many referees at that time did. I believe ray Aldous was one such though I have to say my first thought when looking at the picture was Peter Bye of Bedford.

Left Field

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Ray Aldous is an interesting suggestion. The Gillingham picture is not the clearest so not easy to tell but a newspaper report did once describe him as "one of the more histrionic referees from East Anglia" which might fit with the extravagant gesture in the picture. Below he is seen in a game at Fulham:

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The sock and boot-styles are similar but I'm not otherwise convinced. It's unfortunate the Gillingham picture doesn't have a more precise date. It looks a summery scene and if it were Summer 1966 Mr. Aldous would have departed by then but if it were actually from 1965 he could be in the running.

nemesis

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Ray Aldous is an interesting suggestion. The Gillingham picture is not the clearest so not easy to tell but a newspaper report did once describe him as "one of the more histrionic referees from East Anglia" which might fit with the extravagant gesture in the picture. Below he is seen in a game at Fulham:

The sock and boot-styles are similar but I'm not otherwise convinced. It's unfortunate the Gillingham picture doesn't have a more precise date. It looks a summery scene and if it were Summer 1966 Mr. Aldous would have departed by then but if it were actually from 1965 he could be in the running.

Season 1965/6 finished unusually late right at the end of May, in Division Three at least.

There seems a marked resemblance, not just socks and laces, between the official(s) in the two pictures. I'd go for our man from Ipswich.


Whistleblower

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Indeed, if ever in doubt, go with Ipswich. I'm also for Ray being the mystery man.

olddeagle

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I think Aldous is probably the best bet. Peter Bye was shorter,  and David Wells (Luton) was not only shorter but extremely dapper in appearance and would probably not have appeared in rolled up sleeves. Attached is a very poor image of him doing Bedford Town v Luton in the local county cup in 63/4 but I think it's enough to establish he isn't our man at Gillingham.

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Whistleblower

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The referee, whom we are assuming is Ray Aldous, perfectly displays the three white triangles which were so common at that time, consisting of the left and right ends of the white collar together with the white T shirt.

David Wells is not someone whom I remember at all but I have to agree that the photograph, even though he is distant, does portray great dapperness. In those days referees who were particular about their appearance always boiled their white laces and the front of their shorts had an ironed crease on which you could cut your finger !

Acme Thunderer

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Ray Aldous is an interesting suggestion. The Gillingham picture is not the clearest so not easy to tell but a newspaper report did once describe him as "one of the more histrionic referees from East Anglia" which might fit with the extravagant gesture in the picture. Below he is seen in a game at Fulham:

(Attachment Link)

The sock and boot-styles are similar but I'm not otherwise convinced. It's unfortunate the Gillingham picture doesn't have a more precise date. It looks a summery scene and if it were Summer 1966 Mr. Aldous would have departed by then but if it were actually from 1965 he could be in the running.

The summer scene, with sleeves rolled up, seems to confirm my hunch of Gills v Watford which was played on 18th September 1965 (late summer at least) and which was definitely refereed by Mr Aldous. 

Boiled white laces reminded me of a short term southern FL ref who always brought spare white laces and, if his linesmen didn't have clean white laces already, insisted that they change. At the other end of the spectrum, Keith Styles told of the linesman who turned up at Anfield for a crucial Div 1 game and promptly got out a knife to remove the mud from the previous weekend!

nemesis

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Ray Aldous is an interesting suggestion. The Gillingham picture is not the clearest so not easy to tell but a newspaper report did once describe him as "one of the more histrionic referees from East Anglia" which might fit with the extravagant gesture in the picture. Below he is seen in a game at Fulham:

(Attachment Link)

The sock and boot-styles are similar but I'm not otherwise convinced. It's unfortunate the Gillingham picture doesn't have a more precise date. It looks a summery scene and if it were Summer 1966 Mr. Aldous would have departed by then but if it were actually from 1965 he could be in the running.

The summer scene, with sleeves rolled up, seems to confirm my hunch of Gills v Watford which was played on 18th September 1965 (late summer at least) and which was definitely refereed by Mr Aldous. 



Given that the practice of wearing an unnecessary away kit was decades away, why would Watford not be wearing their normal colours ?

Left Field

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Thanks to olddeagle for the David Wells picture. It's always good to come across images of referees from more than fifty years ago - aside from the big names they are hard to find. One unusual aspect of Mr. Wells's career is he actually started refereeing Football League games a couple of months into the 1963-1964 season although he wasn't named on the Referees List until 1964. The same also occurred with GWT (Geoff?) Davis of Romford. These were very rare examples of referees being promoted mid-season.

I also liked AT's anecdote about the linesman cleaning his boots pre-match. Obviously not the done thing but his nonchalance perhaps deserves some commendation. Did Keith Styles share that feeling or was he more disapproving? Perhaps one of those gestures more likely to be admired if the official then goes out gives a great performance; likely to badly backfire when a poor display transpires. It would be interesting to know if the linesman in question was someone on the edge of retirement who felt he had little to lose or a newcomer who was maybe being naive or just a little cocky?
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olddeagle

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I think I posted this link to a video clip on the old site but can't find it. It shows a glimpse of the dapper Mr Wells involved in a bizarre penalty incident when doing Plymouth v Man City in 64/5. He was a disciple of the dramatic gesture school of refereeing.

http://greensonscreen.co.uk/mancity64H.asp
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reflector

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It doesn't  surprise me to hear the Keith Styles story.  He was always vey smartly turned out and someone I would also describe as dapper.  One of my favourite referees of the period and someone who, despite getting some very good appointments, never made the FIFA list or the FA Cup Final which surprised me.
« Last Edit: Thu 18 Oct 2018 23:33 by reflector »
reflector

OwdReds

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I think I posted this link to a video clip on the old site but can't find it. It shows a glimpse of the dapper Mr Wells involved in a bizarre penalty incident when doing Plymouth v Man City in 64/5. He was a disciple of the dramatic gesture school of refereeing.

http://greensonscreen.co.uk/mancity64H.asp

Many thanks for the clip. As you say some dramatic gestures there. I remember seeing a similarly passed penalty in a League Cup tie between Blackburn Rovers and Barrow a couple of years later and a quote from Bryan Douglas who passed to Mike Ferguson saying that he believed they were the first to do it in a competitive match. Clearly wrong.

Acme Thunderer

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I recall Keith Styles was not best pleased with his knife-wielding linesman! Keith refereed several times at Anfield over the years, so it is not possible to say which match it was and whether the linesman was new to the list or coming up to retirement. As you say, Keith was a small dapper man and a good ref. I think I saw him just once - Palace v Chelsea in Div 1 in Nov 1971 and he did well. I can find no trace of Keith on olddeagle's list of Final officials, so assume that he never made it to Wembley. Upton's shows that he refereed the 2nd leg of the Anglo-Scottish Final in Dec 1978, bizarrely between Burnley and Oldham, but that is imo scant reward for 14 seasons good service on the FL refs list.