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Author Topic: Referees 1945-46 to 1968-69 birth dates / birth years?  (Read 307 times)

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John Treleven

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Can any of the learned brethren here throw any light on the ages of these referees,
other than that they were probably aged 35-47 when they finished?

01   Atherton   Albert              Runcorn   1961   1964
02   Ball           Harry (Harold?)      Worcester     1951   1954
03   Barker   Ron (Ronald?)      Crewe   1967   1971
04   Barker   S   W                   Bexleyheath   1956   1958
05   Baxter   James "Jim"   J   Royston   1956   1959
06   Berry   Herbert              Huddersfield   1936   1948
07   Brooks   John   H                   Edmonton   1959   1960
08   Brown   Lawrence              Barnes   1945   1949
09   Bryan   Harry (Harold?)      Tipton   1946   1948
10   Carr           James "Jim"   E   Sheffield   1959   1968
11   Clark           George              Lee, S.E.12   1945   1951
12   Dennis   Charles   H           Merstham / Ashtead, Surrey    1958   1960
13   Edge           Arthur              Liverpool   1960   1965
14   Hawcroft   Arthur              Rotherham   1959   1961
15   Haworth   Harry (Harold?)      Blackburn   1948   1959
16   Haynes   William "Bill"   E   Newburgh, Ormskirk   1961   1964
17   Hemingway John "Jack" H           Pontefract   1959   1961
18   Holt           Harry (sic)              Rochdale   1945   1951
19   Hunt           James "Jim"   W   Matlock / Portsmouth    1953   1960
20   Jones   Arthur              Rainhill, St. Helens   1953   1955
21   Markham   Kenneth "Ken"      Woking   1967   1969
22   Martin   Geoffrey "Geoff"   Whitchurch, Hampshire   1964   1966
23   Martin   Percy (sic)              Cobham   1949   1954
24   Martin   William "Bill"      Leeds   1938   1948
25   Mason   Arthur Leonard "Len"   Aylesford, Maidstone   1960   1962
26   Oliver   George   E           Middlesbrough   1955   1958
27   Powell   George   T           Newport, Wales   1964   1966
28   Reid           Frederick "Fred"      Letchworth   1960   1961
29   Richards   J W                           Cheadle / Cheadle Heath    1948   1950
30   Schofield   Fred (Frederick?)        Morecambe   1963   1965
31   Singleton   George              Hoghton, Preston   1967   1969
32   South   J                      Darlington   1947   1949
33   Thompson   L   D                   Worksop   1948   1951
34   Toothill   Harry (sic)              Wigan   1950   1953
35   Ward           A                      Bristol   1948   1949
36   Williams   Frederick "Fred"   C   Oxford   1951   1955
37   Williams   Harold              Sheffield   1966   1975
38   Wright   H   J                   Thornton Heath     1950   1953

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Left Field

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Ron Barker was aged 33 on appointment in 1967 suggesting he was born in 1934 or late 1933.

Jim Carr - a Football League Review profile in January 1968 gave his age as 46 suggesting he was born in 1921. After spending some time refereeing in the USA he returned to Sheffield but by 1975 was in New Zealand though it's not clear if that was a visit or he had emigrated there.

Bill Haynes died in 1967 aged just 41.

Arthur Edge died in 1965, apparently shortly after the end of the season though no age was given.

Ken Markham - a profile from 1968 said he took up refereeing at the age of 23 and had been doing so for 17 years. That suggests an age of 40 which seems not to fit with him being a platoon commander in the War and I suspect he was either several years older at least or there's an error in the army detail.

G.T, Powell of Newport - age not known but he had been a FL linesman since 1954 which suggests he was at least in his late thirties and more likely forties on becoming a FL referee. Clive Thomas's autobiography give his first name as Geoff while one newspaper report suggested it was Godfrey and another said Goronwy but one would assume Clive Thomas would be the most accurate source.
« Last Edit: Fri 18 Sep 2020 11:38 by Left Field »

Acme Thunderer

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I posted this on the old ISOR on 2nd September 2017, so yes, Ron Barker would have been born between Sept 1933 and August 1934.

 Funeral service for Ronald Barker took place this week in Crewe. Confirmed that this was the former FL ref. Ron, as he was usually known, was 83 when he died and would therefore have been a youngish 33-34 when he came on to the FL refs list in 1967. The reasons for his departure from the list just 4 years later at the age of 37-38 is not known. He must have been one of a dwindling number of refs who came on to the list in the 1960s. RIP Ron.
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Timbo

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Arthur Jones, whom you have recorded as being from Rainhill near St. Helens (1953-1955) is presumably not the Arthur Jones who was latterly of Ormskirk. The latter was a FL referee in the 1960's and was an FA Staff Instructor in the late 1980's. I would guess that Arthur was maybe in his late-60's or early-70's then, so this is presumably a different man ?

In fact, this link suggests that Arthur Jones of Ormskirk might well have still been on the FL in the 1970's :-

https://twitter.com/FortheR93378109/status/1166801391198846976

Interesting to see that the elusive Frederick "Fred" C Williams of Oxford (1951-1955) is on your list. I think that we have recently established that he might well have been a Royal Navy man who relocated from Plymouth at the conclusion of WWII. If that is correct, he could feasibly have originated anywhere ! 
« Last Edit: Sun 20 Sep 2020 12:22 by Timbo »

Leggy

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I was also "instructed" by Arthur Jones at Lincoln (in the Bishop Grosseteste Teacher Training College) in the late 1980s (or maybe early 90s?) 1992 ***. 

He took our second year and started the week by each one of us giving a presentation to allegedly display what we had learnt at last year's course and subsequently.  We all did our short presentations and - as a group - felt quite smug.  Arthur Jones said little, sucked on his pipe for a few seconds and then burst our bubble with the words:  "Gentlemen, we have a lot of work to do". 

I never saw him referee, but Arthur was a great instructor - we did the work and benefited from his experience and expertise.

*** Edited to provide the correct year.  I recounted the story to Mrs Leggy last night and she reminded me that was the year we met (which I should have remembered and  - at some point later this week - I will be able to exit the dog house :-[)
« Last Edit: Sun 20 Sep 2020 10:27 by Leggy »

Acme Thunderer

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There is a very good sighting of Arthur on YouTube, Man City v Man Utd 1-3, 1976/77, about 1:30 in. A very smart, elegant, military-looking man, and I can just imagine him sucking on his pipe before launching into a critique of the presentations made before him.

I did my course at Lilleshall in the 1970s with Sid Stoakes, and I certainly recall the hard bed 'dorms' of year 1, and the chap in the room next to me in year 2 who insisted on listening to the midnight news with the volume turned up, with the peacocks beginning their squawking 3-4 hours later. It was not a place for relaxation and I was exhausted by the end!   
« Last Edit: Sat 19 Sep 2020 16:44 by Acme Thunderer »
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John Treleven

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There were two Arthur Jones post war

Arthur (no other initials) Jones of Rainhill, St. Helen's 1953-55 presumably born about 1920 (and that is the one I am after)

and

Arthur Wynne S. Jones of Liverpool, then Ormskirk 1963-77 who was born in 1930 and "survived" to the age limit of 47
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