Author Topic: The VAR thread  (Read 58303 times)

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Readingfan

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Re: The VAR thread
« Reply #135 on: Sun 12 May 2019 21:27 »
All 10 PL games had 'offline' VAR testing today.

There has been quite a lot in the media about VAR over the weekend.

Readingfan

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Re: The VAR thread
« Reply #136 on: Tue 14 May 2019 17:24 »
Richard Keys has tweeted that Mike Riley has backed down on his policy regarding referees generally not using pitchside monitors and PL referees will follow the example of Champmions League referees, etc. in using them.

If accurate, it seems odd for Riley to suddenly change his approach at this point after a whole season of using a different system.

Personally I think that use of pitchside monitors is appropriate for tighter/more subjective decisions but at times their use in other competitions has been unnecessary - if a referee is happy to take advice of VAR without consulting monitor I'm fine with that too (e..g if Zidane headbutt had been missed in 2006 final - if referee said that he'd missed it and VAR said  'violent heatbutt into chest, clear red card' I don't think it would be necessary for the referee to look for himself.
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Toprefm

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Re: The VAR thread
« Reply #137 on: Wed 15 May 2019 10:24 »
Richard Keys has tweeted that Mike Riley has backed down on his policy regarding referees generally not using pitchside monitors and PL referees will follow the example of Champmions League referees, etc. in using them.

If accurate, it seems odd for Riley to suddenly change his approach at this point after a whole season of using a different system.

Personally I think that use of pitchside monitors is appropriate for tighter/more subjective decisions but at times their use in other competitions has been unnecessary - if a referee is happy to take advice of VAR without consulting monitor I'm fine with that too (e..g if Zidane headbutt had been missed in 2006 final - if referee said that he'd missed it and VAR said  'violent heatbutt into chest, clear red card' I don't think it would be necessary for the referee to look for himself.

I agree it should ultimately be the on field referee having the final say and therein lies the problem with VAR. Who's opinion is the more correct for use of a better phrase. The on field ref who sees it in real time and deems it a red card or the off field ref who sees it from god knows how many angles and says yellow.

Opinions will always vary as this great site demonstrates

Personally I would bet that a certain gentleman from Uefa or Fifa or both has had a word saying do it this way or English refs will suffer in international appointments as demonstrated on the CL knock out latter stage  games already this season.
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flipmode

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Re: The VAR thread
« Reply #138 on: Mon 20 May 2019 01:09 »
Over in Australia, Perth Glory and Sydney FC contested the A League Grand Final over the weekend. Sydney FC went on to win the Final on penalties, but earlier in the game in the first game had a goal ruled out for offside, which was supported by the VAR.
The reasoning given was because the offside was "too tight to call".



Thoughts?

A video for the highlights of the game can be found here - https://www.foxsports.com.au/video/football/a-league/match-highlights/per-v-syd-match-highlights!731419
David Silva olé.

rustyref

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Re: The VAR thread
« Reply #139 on: Mon 20 May 2019 17:28 »
Should have given the goal as he is clearly onside (assuming the line is correct).  Offside should never be too close to call, you are either on or off, or level in which case you are on.

Readingfan

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Re: The VAR thread
« Reply #140 on: Mon 20 May 2019 17:43 »
Should have given the goal as he is clearly onside (assuming the line is correct).  Offside should never be too close to call, you are either on or off, or level in which case you are on.

It does depend on the quality of the technology available though.

I have seen some clips from the MLS in America where they seemingly only have the camera angles (sometimes not even fully in line) and don't have any lines to impose, etc. and there have been times the VAR has said something along the lines of 'we can't tell' and gone with the on-field decision.

I heard the other week that in the Premier League they will be using a 2D system rather than the 3D system that was used at the World Cup so there is some room for potential inaccuracy in offside VAR decisions.

Ashington46

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Re: The VAR thread
« Reply #141 on: Mon 20 May 2019 17:49 »
Should have given the goal as he is clearly onside (assuming the line is correct).  Offside should never be too close to call, you are either on or off, or level in which case you are on.

It does depend on the quality of the technology available though.

I have seen some clips from the MLS in America where they seemingly only have the camera angles (sometimes not even fully in line) and don't have any lines to impose, etc. and there have been times the VAR has said something along the lines of 'we can't tell' and gone with the on-field decision.

I heard the other week that in the Premier League they will be using a 2D system rather than the 3D system that was used at the World Cup so there is some room for potential inaccuracy in offside VAR decisions.

Don't tell me that there will be a potential for VAR to be wrong ---that would just be the same as a wrong decision by the onfield officials ---we can't have any of that in modern football ---I thought that everything had to be 100% correct to keep everyone happy.
WHat is the game coming to?  :D
Referee's decision used to be final!
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flipmode

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Re: The VAR thread
« Reply #142 on: Tue 21 May 2019 00:28 »
Should have given the goal as he is clearly onside (assuming the line is correct).  Offside should never be too close to call, you are either on or off, or level in which case you are on.

My offside interpretation aligns perfectly with yours.  ;D
David Silva olé.

Readingfan

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Re: The VAR thread
« Reply #143 on: Fri 24 May 2019 12:26 »
An interview with Mike Riley - https://www.premierleague.com/news/1214130

Perhaps the most interesting aspect is when he says 'There will be a panel of Premier League referees who are VARs and we're recruiting five Championship referees to act as VARs as well'

He also says they expect accuracy of KMI to improve from 82% to 87% - I wonder what the remaining 13% are that they still think will be wrong? (I guess mainly those outside VAR protocol such as second yellow cards or incorrect corners leaidng up to goals, etc.)
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Readingfan

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Re: The VAR thread
« Reply #144 on: Tue 04 Jun 2019 17:30 »
Some decisions regarding communication of VAR in Premier League will be made tomorrow - https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/premier-league-clubs-to-decide-over-showing-var-replays-8fnr0wxks

Contrary to what the article says, weren't replays shown on big screens at the World Cup when a decision had been changed by VAR?

I laughed at the suggestion that fans could sign up for a text message service:

'Hey George mate, I've just had a text to say that the goal's been given'.

'I know Fred, they've just kicked-off again.'

'Oh, so that's why everyone was celebrating.'

My phone normally doesn't work properly around a football stadium anyway!

bruntyboy

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Re: The VAR thread
« Reply #145 on: Tue 04 Jun 2019 23:27 »
Richard Keys has tweeted that Mike Riley has backed down on his policy regarding referees generally not using pitchside monitors and PL referees will follow the example of Champmions League referees, etc. in using them.

If accurate, it seems odd for Riley to suddenly change his approach at this point after a whole season of using a different system.

Personally I think that use of pitchside monitors is appropriate for tighter/more subjective decisions but at times their use in other competitions has been unnecessary - if a referee is happy to take advice of VAR without consulting monitor I'm fine with that too (e..g if Zidane headbutt had been missed in 2006 final - if referee said that he'd missed it and VAR said  'violent heatbutt into chest, clear red card' I don't think it would be necessary for the referee to look for himself.

I agree it should ultimately be the on field referee having the final say and therein lies the problem with VAR. Who's opinion is the more correct for use of a better phrase. The on field ref who sees it in real time and deems it a red card or the off field ref who sees it from god knows how many angles and says yellow.

Opinions will always vary as this great site demonstrates

Personally I would bet that a certain gentleman from Uefa or Fifa or both has had a word saying do it this way or English refs will suffer in international appointments as demonstrated on the CL knock out latter stage  games already this season.

Given the involvement of as many as 4 English teams from the quarter finals onwards (and only one quarter final tie had no English teams) it was hardly surprising the English refs weren't involved
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Readingfan

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Re: The VAR thread
« Reply #146 on: Tue 04 Jun 2019 23:39 »
Richard Keys has tweeted that Mike Riley has backed down on his policy regarding referees generally not using pitchside monitors and PL referees will follow the example of Champmions League referees, etc. in using them.

If accurate, it seems odd for Riley to suddenly change his approach at this point after a whole season of using a different system.

Personally I think that use of pitchside monitors is appropriate for tighter/more subjective decisions but at times their use in other competitions has been unnecessary - if a referee is happy to take advice of VAR without consulting monitor I'm fine with that too (e..g if Zidane headbutt had been missed in 2006 final - if referee said that he'd missed it and VAR said  'violent heatbutt into chest, clear red card' I don't think it would be necessary for the referee to look for himself.

I agree it should ultimately be the on field referee having the final say and therein lies the problem with VAR. Who's opinion is the more correct for use of a better phrase. The on field ref who sees it in real time and deems it a red card or the off field ref who sees it from god knows how many angles and says yellow.

Opinions will always vary as this great site demonstrates

Personally I would bet that a certain gentleman from Uefa or Fifa or both has had a word saying do it this way or English refs will suffer in international appointments as demonstrated on the CL knock out latter stage  games already this season.

Given the involvement of as many as 4 English teams from the quarter finals onwards (and only one quarter final tie had no English teams) it was hardly surprising the English refs weren't involved

I think it's clear that it was because they didn't have VAR experience - only referees with VAR experience were used, with some of them getting two matches in the same knockout round which is very unusual.

Even if all four English teams had got knocked out in the last 16, I don't think Oliver or Taylor would have had a CL refereeing appointment.

Readingfan

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Re: The VAR thread
« Reply #147 on: Wed 05 Jun 2019 18:37 »
It's been announced that some replays of decisions changed by VAR will be shown on big screens where relevant - https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/48534031

I think that this is a good move.

What I would really like to see is a move towards the media communication in the MLS - they have some excellent resources they produce, such as Inside Video Review where you can hear the discussions between the officials (I believe this has also been done in other countries, such as Netherlands although obviously in Dutch!) - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6I-2PjtOzE
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carrowman

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Re: The VAR thread
« Reply #148 on: Thu 06 Jun 2019 21:40 »
England v Holland, Lingard goal disallowed for offside by VAR.

Perfect example of it being too close to call and the benefit should go to the forward. They have to do something like in cricket with Umpires call if the margin isn't significant. They have to make the line wider to take the closeness out.
.
Also do what they do in Rugby and physically stop the clock when VAR is being used

Ashington46

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Re: The VAR thread
« Reply #149 on: Thu 06 Jun 2019 22:43 »
England v Holland, Lingard goal disallowed for offside by VAR.

Perfect example of it being too close to call and the benefit should go to the forward. They have to do something like in cricket with Umpires call if the margin isn't significant. They have to make the line wider to take the closeness out.
.
Also do what they do in Rugby and physically stop the clock when VAR is being used

Totally disagree, it is what the modern fan and the media want, therefore they have to ensure that every decision is 100% correct. AR is instructed not to flag so how can it then be like cricket because no call has been made?

I am totally against VAR, however, it is the way that our beloved game is going and we will just have to accept it as the way forward because UEFA and FIFA are totally behind its use.
As far as stopping the clock is concerned --when do you do this? In last night's match the  game had progressed down the other end of the field when there was a review of an incident in the other penalty area  resulting in a penalty. Should t he clock them be wound back to when the original offence was deemed to have been committed or when the incident was referred which was some  time later?

The whole thing is a total mess, however, it will rule the game from now on --very sad indeed. Goal line technology is great, however, VAR ............
Referee's decision used to be final!
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