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Author Topic: Rob Jones Newcastle v Leicester  (Read 1449 times)

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DublinRef

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Re: Rob Jones Newcastle v Leicester
« Reply #15 on: Sun 03 Jan 2021 19:32 »
I thought he had a good game, aside from the ball hitting him I can't think of much wrong.  He does look a bit laboured but I think that is down to his sheer size, and bigger referees do tend to look a bit "lumbering", similar to Andre Marriner.

Happens to the best of them as well as Anthony Taylor just got hit by the ball as well.  Patterns of play are very different in the Premier League to the Championship and it may well be that Jones is still trying to get used to that.  There's a lot more central passing and playing through the middle of the pitch so it will undoubtedly affect positioning.  I remember when I refereed PL and FL reserve games, I always felt like I was getting in the way and had to remember to stay still and let the players work around me, if I'd done that in a Ryman league game I would undoubtedly have been in the way.

I'd agree rustyref, I thought he had a decent game. Getting hit by the ball was unfortunate and adds extra visibility you don't want but I would agree with your assessment of it, not a major issue.

On the whole he does strike me as ever so slightly uncomfortable still which is perfectly understandable given his lack of experience at this level. I must say I am not yet seeing why there was such a fuss about him in the Championship but I'm sure his class will shine through eventually once he gets the proper coaching and experience.

One thing I definitely think he should change - occasionally he makes an almost sneering expression when talking to players, sort of a "oh come on what are you on about" look. Maybe its just me but it rubbed me up the wrong way slightly and I think gave across a slightly aloof feeling. I'm really nit picking though, I think he can be happy enough overall with todays game and I wish him continued success.

Some interesting comments above.  Anticipating the pattern of play comes with experience in the PL I guess, but I did think he was too close to the action on occasions.  I'd noted in games earlier this season that the likes of Taylor and Oliver seem very adept at a hop, skip, and a jump to avoid the ball if they've found themselves in the way or caught out with an unexpected pass that switched play.  Ironic that Taylor should be struck by the ball today.

As to 'lumbering', I imagine he takes pretty long strides so perhaps that mitigates against the fast sprints that some smaller referees require.

Curious that DublinRef refers to his looking a little 'aloof'.  In his previous game I felt that his manner / body language showed a hint of arrogance but I didn't like to comment at the time as I put it down to perhaps a touch of nerves or not being totally relaxed.

Overall though, I thought he did ok today and hope he continues to improve and settle in the PL.

Ref Fan I think I am probably wrong to use the word aloof. Arrogance is a better description as you have described, quite possibly due to nerves as you say.

Ref Fan

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Re: Rob Jones Newcastle v Leicester
« Reply #16 on: Sun 03 Jan 2021 19:55 »
Quoting Ashington46 -
"DublinRef ---many thanks for your last paragraph, I thought that it was just me who noticed this tendency. It certainly gives the impression of arrogance and is something which will rile many fans who just don't need an excuse to get upset!"

Apologies Ashington46, I hadn't spotted your comment when I posted.  Reassuring to know I wasn't the only one who got this impression of him.
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Ashington46

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Re: Rob Jones Newcastle v Leicester
« Reply #17 on: Sun 03 Jan 2021 20:29 »
Quoting Ashington46 -
"DublinRef ---many thanks for your last paragraph, I thought that it was just me who noticed this tendency. It certainly gives the impression of arrogance and is something which will rile many fans who just don't need an excuse to get upset!"

Apologies Ashington46, I hadn't spotted your comment when I posted.  Reassuring to know I wasn't the only one who got this impression of him.

No need to apologise. Life goes on regardless ---in spite of our opinions and technology!
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Gorgeous George

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Re: Rob Jones Newcastle v Leicester
« Reply #18 on: Sun 03 Jan 2021 20:34 »
I agree with the general sentiment from you all today. Personally felt Jones had a good steady game today. Probably just what he needed after a week of spotlight and chatter around a decision last week that I personally felt wasn’t all that wrong... it certainly was not different than some of his colleagues normally award as soft normally safe free kicks (looking at Madley giving a similarly soft defensive free kick yesterday at Brighton). He’s an easy media target as an up and coming ref and some of the comments (including on here last weekend) have been more than a little exaggerated given we are talking about one completely understandable free kick award.

I have come across him a few times lower down the system (contributory and panel league) and he was always a very humble young man, and I think any “arrogant” or “aloof” expressions are probably more of a way of deflecting criticism from high profile players.

Not a great thing to get hit by the ball but having seen the same happen to one of our Elite FIFA referees this afternoon I’m sure this can be put down to a learning curve and no harm done.

Solid display with plenty more to come I am sure...
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PhiltheRef

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Re: Rob Jones Newcastle v Leicester
« Reply #19 on: Sun 03 Jan 2021 22:05 »
I think that given more time and less grief he definitely has what it takes to reach the top.

I remembered today that he reffed a Play Off final very early in his career and, IIRC, was very good.

He is a very personable and approachable guy from my experience, not in any way aloof. Like many Merseysiders he has the gift of the gab and I believe that once he settles in, the perceived "sneer" will be recognised more for what it is.

The view of him lumbering is, I believe, because he is a big guy with a long stride (look at him taking the knee) who probably isn't going to look very nimble even when the ball doesn't hit him
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rustyref

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Re: Rob Jones Newcastle v Leicester
« Reply #20 on: Sun 03 Jan 2021 22:37 »
I think that given more time and less grief he definitely has what it takes to reach the top.

I remembered today that he reffed a Play Off final very early in his career and, IIRC, was very good.

He is a very personable and approachable guy from my experience, not in any way aloof. Like many Merseysiders he has the gift of the gab and I believe that once he settles in, the perceived "sneer" will be recognised more for what it is.

The view of him lumbering is, I believe, because he is a big guy with a long stride (look at him taking the knee) who probably isn't going to look very nimble even when the ball doesn't hit him

I've seen him in grounds as opposed to on TV a few times and he certainly gets around the pitch well.  When you consider that he is taller than Andy Carroll, and a lot broader as well (I noticed this when he was speaking to him in the Newcastle vs Brentford game), he clearly isn't going to zip around the pitch like a Taylor or Oliver.  Carroll is 6'4" so that must put Jones at 6'5"+.

As I said before, I didn't see anything wrong in this game other than him getting hit by the ball and sometimes that just happens.  I went years without being hit by the ball then got hit twice within 5 minutes in the same game, just one of those things.

Hendo

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Re: Rob Jones Newcastle v Leicester
« Reply #21 on: Sun 03 Jan 2021 22:53 »
One of Scotland’s greatest ever refs “Tiny” Wharton was not noted for his athleticism, being well over 6 foot and 15 stone, but was a great referee. Same could be said of the likes of Jack Taylor and Dick Jol, not the most nimble on their feet.
The Cootes and Attwells of this world probably cover far more ground but whether their decision making is any better for it is open to debate I would suggest.
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Acme Thunderer

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Re: Rob Jones Newcastle v Leicester
« Reply #22 on: Mon 04 Jan 2021 08:45 »
Thankfully, 'style of running' is not something which has become robotic over the years. We may never see a Kirkpatrick or Fussey again, but running style has to be individual, and Rob Jones is one who can easily be spotted through his rather 'lumbering' style of running.

More akin to Jones at Leeds v Burnley, but Andrew Madley disallowed a Brighton goal (v Wolves) for a foul on a defender in the build-up to the goal, and he had already whistled before the ball hit the back of the net. The studio pundit thought that he should have waited and then had the build up reviewed by VAR, but I thought Andrew acted quite correctly in calling what seemed to be an obvious push on the defender, perhaps in consultation with the AR on the far side who was well placed. Brave or foolhardy? I prefer brave.
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anje-roo

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Re: Rob Jones Newcastle v Leicester
« Reply #23 on: Mon 04 Jan 2021 09:00 »
Re. Andy Madley's "brave" call, I was watching MoTD highlights & my immediate reactions were (1) not a foul, (2) Andy Madley wasn't in the best position (3) why whistle immediately given directives & (4) had Sian Massey-Ellis signalled a foul? I thought the commentator Jonathan Pierce (not everyone's favourite) was spot-on.

If play had continued (as it effectively did, with a goal being scored) without the whistle then VAR would have looked at the potential foul. Then we would be having an argument about whether VAR would have advised Andy Madley to look at a screen or VAR would have allowed the goal as there wasn't any clear & obvious error. Had it been a UEFA/FIFA game with VAR then the chances are that Andy Madley would be marked down (and his future UEFA/FIFA appointments would reflect such). I doubt we'll be hearing anything from PL/PGMOL - mainly because the 2 teams involved are not big names!
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ajb95

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Re: Rob Jones Newcastle v Leicester
« Reply #24 on: Mon 04 Jan 2021 10:15 »
Re. Andy Madley's "brave" call, I was watching MoTD highlights & my immediate reactions were (1) not a foul, (2) Andy Madley wasn't in the best position (3) why whistle immediately given directives & (4) had Sian Massey-Ellis signalled a foul? I thought the commentator Jonathan Pierce (not everyone's favourite) was spot-on.

If play had continued (as it effectively did, with a goal being scored) without the whistle then VAR would have looked at the potential foul. Then we would be having an argument about whether VAR would have advised Andy Madley to look at a screen or VAR would have allowed the goal as there wasn't any clear & obvious error. Had it been a UEFA/FIFA game with VAR then the chances are that Andy Madley would be marked down (and his future UEFA/FIFA appointments would reflect such). I doubt we'll be hearing anything from PL/PGMOL - mainly because the 2 teams involved are not big names!

Why should Andy have to wait 5 minutes for someone in front of a screen to decide if it’s a foul or not, possibly send him over to the screen for another 2-3 minutes to make a decision himself! I applaud Madley for giving a foul for a push on the defending player and not relying on the robots at Stockeley park. The decision is being made by the man on the field!
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Ashington46

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Re: Rob Jones Newcastle v Leicester
« Reply #25 on: Mon 04 Jan 2021 12:42 »
Re. Andy Madley's "brave" call, I was watching MoTD highlights & my immediate reactions were (1) not a foul, (2) Andy Madley wasn't in the best position (3) why whistle immediately given directives & (4) had Sian Massey-Ellis signalled a foul? I thought the commentator Jonathan Pierce (not everyone's favourite) was spot-on.

If play had continued (as it effectively did, with a goal being scored) without the whistle then VAR would have looked at the potential foul. Then we would be having an argument about whether VAR would have advised Andy Madley to look at a screen or VAR would have allowed the goal as there wasn't any clear & obvious error. Had it been a UEFA/FIFA game with VAR then the chances are that Andy Madley would be marked down (and his future UEFA/FIFA appointments would reflect such). I doubt we'll be hearing anything from PL/PGMOL - mainly because the 2 teams involved are not big names!

Why should Andy have to wait 5 minutes for someone in front of a screen to decide if it’s a foul or not, possibly send him over to the screen for another 2-3 minutes to make a decision himself! I applaud Madley for giving a foul for a push on the defending player and not relying on the robots at Stockeley park. The decision is being made by the man on the field!

I agree, however, the sad thing about all of this is the fact that the argument is all about whether or not he should have whistled when he did or should he have waited for the outcome etc., etc. 
Why?

Is the onfield referee not allowed to make a decision, must he wait for the outcome if a foul is  committed by a defender in his own half when clearing the ball just in case a goal is scored form the clearance?
It is all going silly. ARs not flagging, even in cases when the forward is a yard offside, referees not expected to whistle when they spot an offence etc. etc.  Where does it all end?
Referee's decision used to be final!
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TVOS

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Re: Rob Jones Newcastle v Leicester
« Reply #26 on: Mon 04 Jan 2021 13:21 »
Thankfully, 'style of running' is not something which has become robotic over the years. We may never see a Kirkpatrick or Fussey again, but running style has to be individual, and Rob Jones is one who can easily be spotted through his rather 'lumbering' style of running.

More akin to Jones at Leeds v Burnley, but Andrew Madley disallowed a Brighton goal (v Wolves) for a foul on a defender in the build-up to the goal, and he had already whistled before the ball hit the back of the net. The studio pundit thought that he should have waited and then had the build up reviewed by VAR, but I thought Andrew acted quite correctly in calling what seemed to be an obvious push on the defender, perhaps in consultation with the AR on the far side who was well placed. Brave or foolhardy? I prefer brave.

It wasn't really an obvious push though. It might have looked it from Madley's angle, but other views contradicted that.

And if that was an "obvious push", the game has gone more than we thought.

Ashington46

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Re: Rob Jones Newcastle v Leicester
« Reply #27 on: Mon 04 Jan 2021 14:46 »
Thankfully, 'style of running' is not something which has become robotic over the years. We may never see a Kirkpatrick or Fussey again, but running style has to be individual, and Rob Jones is one who can easily be spotted through his rather 'lumbering' style of running.

More akin to Jones at Leeds v Burnley, but Andrew Madley disallowed a Brighton goal (v Wolves) for a foul on a defender in the build-up to the goal, and he had already whistled before the ball hit the back of the net. The studio pundit thought that he should have waited and then had the build up reviewed by VAR, but I thought Andrew acted quite correctly in calling what seemed to be an obvious push on the defender, perhaps in consultation with the AR on the far side who was well placed. Brave or foolhardy? I prefer brave.

It wasn't really an obvious push though. It might have looked it from Madley's angle, but other views contradicted that.

And if that was an "obvious push", the game has gone more than we thought.

In the opinion of Andy Madley it was a push, he showed by his actions why he had given the free kick. It doesn't matter what other views were because the referee thought that it was a push.

You are talking about "obvious push" and the game having gone and I will agree that it definitely has because, had that been the defender pushing the attacker in the penalty area, the attacker would have been rolling from  the edge of the box all the way to the goal line to convince the officials that he had been fouled. We would then have had VAR intervening, pundits saying "He felt contact so he is entitled to go down etc., etc." 
Why is it so wrong that a defender got the benefit of the referee's opinion?

It's only a game and not a matter of life and death and Brighton didn't lose and life goes on.
Referee's decision used to be final!
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TVOS

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Re: Rob Jones Newcastle v Leicester
« Reply #28 on: Mon 04 Jan 2021 16:20 »
Thankfully, 'style of running' is not something which has become robotic over the years. We may never see a Kirkpatrick or Fussey again, but running style has to be individual, and Rob Jones is one who can easily be spotted through his rather 'lumbering' style of running.

More akin to Jones at Leeds v Burnley, but Andrew Madley disallowed a Brighton goal (v Wolves) for a foul on a defender in the build-up to the goal, and he had already whistled before the ball hit the back of the net. The studio pundit thought that he should have waited and then had the build up reviewed by VAR, but I thought Andrew acted quite correctly in calling what seemed to be an obvious push on the defender, perhaps in consultation with the AR on the far side who was well placed. Brave or foolhardy? I prefer brave.

It wasn't really an obvious push though. It might have looked it from Madley's angle, but other views contradicted that.

And if that was an "obvious push", the game has gone more than we thought.

In the opinion of Andy Madley it was a push, he showed by his actions why he had given the free kick. It doesn't matter what other views were because the referee thought that it was a push.

You are talking about "obvious push" and the game having gone and I will agree that it definitely has because, had that been the defender pushing the attacker in the penalty area, the attacker would have been rolling from  the edge of the box all the way to the goal line to convince the officials that he had been fouled. We would then have had VAR intervening, pundits saying "He felt contact so he is entitled to go down etc., etc." 
Why is it so wrong that a defender got the benefit of the referee's opinion?

It's only a game and not a matter of life and death and Brighton didn't lose and life goes on.

By "other views" I should have really said "other angles".

I wasn't disputing that Andy Madley thought it was a foul, so I'm not sure why you've presumed that.

I was disputing AT's assertion that it was a foul in the first place.