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Author Topic: Amy Fearn Arsenal v Manchester United WSL  (Read 1397 times)

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PhiltheRef

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Amy Fearn Arsenal v Manchester United WSL
« on: Sat 20 Mar 2021 11:05 »
In my view quite a poor performance by Mrs Fearn last night.
Allowed far too much to go unpunished, particularly in the first half which MAY have led to the dismissal of Beth Mead.
Unusual as when I have seen her before she has displayed an ability to nip things in the bud.
Arsenal players seemed to be queuing up to foul Lauren James and there was an ongoing feud between Katie McCabe and Ella Toone which could have sparked a major issue but fortunately didn't
I have tried to defend officiating in the WSL but tonight's performance I cannot

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guest42

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From reading comments from the United manager - the referee told them she couldn’t take any action about the multiple fouls on the same player because “it’s different players” committing the fouls.

Out of curiosity - how many yellow cards were issued during the game?

Seagull

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From reading comments from the United manager - the referee told them she couldn’t take any action about the multiple fouls on the same player because “it’s different players” committing the fouls.

Out of curiosity - how many yellow cards were issued during the game?

The so-called "team foul" is a problem but eventually, I believe you just have to issue a general warning along the lines of "whoever fouls this player next will be cautioned". It's harsh on that individual player but the fouling has to be stopped.

There were 4 YCs including the 2 for Mead.
« Last Edit: Sat 20 Mar 2021 11:41 by Seagull »

Failed Ref

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Rugby has the answer as is often the case. Repeated fouling by one team, repeated fouls of a particular type or repeated fouling by one player will result in a yellow card. Not tough on individual who cops card for third or fourth team offence because they would have been warned in advance.
On reflection this morning it is one power I would love to see given to referees. Grealish may at least get some protection but his example makes the point that too many players are fouled too often with impunity.
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Ref Fan

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From reading comments from the United manager - the referee told them she couldn’t take any action about the multiple fouls on the same player because “it’s different players” committing the fouls.

Out of curiosity - how many yellow cards were issued during the game?

The so-called "team foul" is a problem but eventually, I believe you just have to issue a general warning along the lines of "whoever fouls this player next will be cautioned". It's harsh on that individual player but the fouling has to be stopped.

There were 4 YCs including the 2 for Mead.

This is what happened in a Chelsea v Man United game a few seasons ago.  United players were targeting Hazard, and Oliver finally booked Herrera for a specific foul and then warned him and the Captain, Smalling, that it had to stop or YCs would be issued.  Within seconds, Herrera committed another foul on Hazard and duly got a second yellow.  Oliver received some stick for issuing a card for a minor offence but there was no complaints from this United supporter.  He did exactly what he'd said he would do.  Referees don't always appear to be alert to this type of 'team foul'.

It would seem strange if Fearn made the alleged comment.

RCG

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I was with Phil Dowd on a game and he cautioned the 3rd player to foul the attacker for the home team. His argument was as it was clearly a tactic, the foul was deliberate and targeted, meaning it was easily reckless rather than careless. An example where intent outweighed the challenge
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Boz

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I recall Howard Webb doing something similar when Moyes' Everton were fouling David Silva by rota. He booked the 4th and 5th foul on him and they took the hint and stopped doing it.

Microscopist

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I recall Howard Webb doing something similar when Moyes' Everton were fouling David Silva by rota. He booked the 4th and 5th foul on him and they took the hint and stopped doing it.
My recollection was of Howard Webb doing it in a Derby game when he awarded four yellow cards for fouls on Shaun Wright-Phillips by different players.

Wollongong Ref

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Players must be protected, if multiple players fouled the same opponent the YC must be brandished. The whole point of multiple players doing this is to avoid the YC and as refs we must protect skillful players.
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nemesis

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Players must be protected, if multiple players fouled the same opponent the YC must be brandished. The whole point of multiple players doing this is to avoid the YC and as refs we must protect skillful players.

I'm sorry but that is neither fair on the players nor consistent with the Laws of the Game. Under the list of cautionable offences, nowhere does it include committing an otherwise non-cautionable foul on a player who has been fouled n times before. What is n? Who keeps track of the current number of fouls against each player and keeps all opponents aware of who can be fouled and who can't?

Half the time, the players who appear to be fouled a lot are the ones who are playing to draw technical fouls/slight touches from opponents.

Sanctions exist for serious fouls.
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Leggy

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Forgive me Nemesis, for rising to the bait, but a while back you (quite reasonably) criticised me for quoting the Laws of the Game as the reason why a foul challenge in the middle of the field should be treated equitably with one in the penalty area.

I think that - in that case - there was a general agreement that while I was right in Law you were right in "reality".

In this case, you are right in Law, but in "reality" some players just happen to be in the wrong place at the wrong time and pick up a caution on behalf of the persistent (and probably pre-meditated) foul challenges committed by his colleagues.
« Last Edit: Mon 22 Mar 2021 06:58 by Leggy »

ACTref

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I recall Michael Oliver doing something similar in an FA Cup match between Chelsea and Manchester United a few years ago.

Hazard was getting the tripe fouled out of him, so Oliver pulled the United captain aside and made a big show of saying the next player to foul Hazard would pick up a caution for Persistent Infringement. Sure enough, the next player to foul Hazard not long after picked up a yellow...which happened to be his second and off he went.

Went down a treat with the United players as you'd expect.

Either way, tactical fouling by a team of a single player is just as much persistent infringement as one player fouling several and as such needs to be identified and sanctioned accordingly.

PhiltheRef

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Surely as whether a challenge ticks the boxes to be a card, of either hue, is the opinion of the Referee then to issue a card to "the next player to foul x" is perfectly acceptable?

LateTackle

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The problem here is that it is far more complicated than simply saying 'The next player to foul X gets a yellow card'.  If that were to happen we would see even more playacting than we see now.  X may well be one of those players who spends much of the game extracting fouls from referees for the slightest contact in order to obtain penalties and promising free kicks.  The worst 'X' has already been mentioned but there are others almost as bad.  It is excruciating enough, with empty grounds, to see these ludicrous fancy-dans hurling themselves around screaming like toddlers.  Imagine if they knew for certain they can get opponents carded with impunity. 

Sharing out the fouls has always been in the game and a competent referee can deal with it sensibly.  Far more important to rid the game of the prima donnas who spend so much time deceiving referees. 
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PhiltheRef

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I wasn't actually advocating this, just explaining how, if required, it could be "explained"