Author Topic: The EFL Carabao Cup – Final (Sun 1st MAR 2020 at Wembley Stadium)  (Read 2446 times)

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flipmode

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Was not expecting this one bit. Yeah, wow.
David Silva olé.

reflector

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I accept that there are not many candidates this year and Mason is having a better season but this does have the look of "a Buggins turn" appointment.  A bit like FIFA badges. match appointments for Cup and Play Off Finals have less to do with earning them these days which can only lead to the further devaluing of what was always seen as an honour. 
reflector

Hendo

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I accept that there are not many candidates this year and Mason is having a better season but this does have the look of "a Buggins turn" appointment.  A bit like FIFA badges. match appointments for Cup and Play Off Finals have less to do with earning them these days which can only lead to the further devaluing of what was always seen as an honour.

Couldn’t agree more. When you think back to all the decent refs of yesteryear who never got a Final - names such as Les Shapter, Dave Allison, Mike Peck, John Martin, Colin Seel, Ray Toseland etc etc etc - the dearth of talent these days almost dictates that bang ordinary refs such as Mason will end up with a Final honour.
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QuoCob

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Very subjective views regarding the appropriateness and suitability of Lee Mason to officiate this final.
He is a Premier League official, has been for a number of years, has been considered to be in the top 21 officials in the country for some time performing to the standard required, which is better than most on here, who have worn the black shirt, will ever be.
He's eligible to officiate this final and 'his turn' is now, why are so many congratulating with questions and/or veiled criticism and comparing him with officials of yesteryear?  Their time was then, they didn't have the opportunity for a prestigious appointment for a number of reasons that are normally forgotten in time, Lee's time is now and he has earned his opportunity to receive the honour.

Well done for the appointment Lee Mason and team, hopefully you all enjoy the experience and have a good game.
“They shall grow not old as we that are left grow old:
Age shall not weary them, nor the years condemn.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning
We will remember them.”  Laurence Binyon
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Hertsref123

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Very subjective views regarding the appropriateness and suitability of Lee Mason to officiate this final.
He is a Premier League official, has been for a number of years, has been considered to be in the top 21 officials in the country for some time performing to the standard required, which is better than most on here, who have worn the black shirt, will ever be.
He's eligible to officiate this final and 'his turn' is now, why are so many congratulating with questions and/or veiled criticism and comparing him with officials of yesteryear?  Their time was then, they didn't have the opportunity for a prestigious appointment for a number of reasons that are normally forgotten in time, Lee's time is now and he has earned his opportunity to receive the honour.

Well done for the appointment Lee Mason and team, hopefully you all enjoy the experience and have a good game.

Youv’e hit the nail on the head here. Some People on this thread aren’t even congratulating him and seem to be just be criticising him for the sake of it. Which i find a bit sad really. Yes Lee mason will never be one of one of our top officials. But he has performed generally well this season, and I for one hope he has a good game.
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Readingfan

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I don't see the issue with people questioning the appointment. It always seems odd to me when people go excessive on the congratulations for a final, as if they know the person or the person is likely to read it. If Simon Hooper is appointed to Chelsea V Spurs this weekend in the PL then no one is going to congratulate him but many would question it, so why should it be that much different for a final? In many ways, the more important the game, the more scrutiny there should be.

When Steve McClaren was appointed England manager, was no one allowed to qustion it because he'd been a manager for quite a few years and it was a big appointment for him?

For what it's worth, I have mixed feelings on the appointment. Lee Mason is an experienced PL referee and I think has had a solid season so it is reasonable that he should come under consideration. But equally I don't think it's wrong to question if he has been fortunate to spend 15 years or so as a PL referee or to ponder if this reflects an overall decline in the depth of refereeing at the top level.

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JohnCoyle

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I accept that there are not many candidates this year and Mason is having a better season but this does have the look of "a Buggins turn" appointment.  A bit like FIFA badges. match appointments for Cup and Play Off Finals have less to do with earning them these days which can only lead to the further devaluing of what was always seen as an honour.

Couldn’t agree more. When you think back to all the decent refs of yesteryear who never got a Final - names such as Les Shapter, Dave Allison, Mike Peck, John Martin, Colin Seel, Ray Toseland etc etc etc - the dearth of talent these days almost dictates that bang ordinary refs such as Mason will end up with a Final honour.

John Martin and Lester Shapter both did the League Cup final. I'll be surprised if Lee Mason gets the FA Cup Final (still considered the biggie) so will probably join their club along with the likes of Ray Lewis and Martin Bodenham.

Hertsref123

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I don't see the issue with people questioning the appointment. It always seems odd to me when people go excessive on the congratulations for a final, as if they know the person or the person is likely to read it. If Simon Hooper is appointed to Chelsea V Spurs this weekend in the PL then no one is going to congratulate him but many would question it, so why should it be that much different for a final? In many ways, the more important the game, the more scrutiny there should be.

When Steve McClaren was appointed England manager, was no one allowed to qustion it because he'd been a manager for quite a few years and it was a big appointment for him?

For what it's worth, I have mixed feelings on the appointment. Lee Mason is an experienced PL referee and I think has had a solid season so it is reasonable that he should come under consideration. But equally I don't think it's wrong to question if he has been fortunate to spend 15 years or so as a PL referee or to ponder if this reflects an overall decline in the depth of refereeing at the top level.

I Don't Agree, A Cup final Is quite a big thing for a referee to get, (Yes I Know how undervalued the league cup is nowadays), why wouldn't you congratulate someone on it, Refs Generally work towards getting these appointments, it's not just a regular league game. Mason may have been poor in previous seasons, but he has in fairness to him been decent this season, it seems some aren't willing to give him any credit for that for some reason. he is getting this on merit this time.
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Hendo

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I don't see the issue with people questioning the appointment. It always seems odd to me when people go excessive on the congratulations for a final, as if they know the person or the person is likely to read it. If Simon Hooper is appointed to Chelsea V Spurs this weekend in the PL then no one is going to congratulate him but many would question it, so why should it be that much different for a final? In many ways, the more important the game, the more scrutiny there should be.

When Steve McClaren was appointed England manager, was no one allowed to qustion it because he'd been a manager for quite a few years and it was a big appointment for him?

For what it's worth, I have mixed feelings on the appointment. Lee Mason is an experienced PL referee and I think has had a solid season so it is reasonable that he should come under consideration. But equally I don't think it's wrong to question if he has been fortunate to spend 15 years or so as a PL referee or to ponder if this reflects an overall decline in the depth of refereeing at the top level.

I Don't Agree, A Cup final Is quite a big thing for a referee to get, (Yes I Know how undervalued the league cup is nowadays), why wouldn't you congratulate someone on it, Refs Generally work towards getting these appointments, it's not just a regular league game. Mason may have been poor in previous seasons, but he has in fairness to him been decent this season, it seems some aren't willing to give him any credit for that for some reason. he is getting this on merit this time.

But is that not the very point we are making. Is he getting this appointment “on merit”? He may have had a better season than most of his 15 years on the PL. However if this appointment is made on merit then I can think of a few refs who have never had the League Cup Final and have been better this season, so why on merit have they not been chosen? Is it not more of a case of “we have a dearth of refs capable - the likes of Tierney, Bankes, Kavanagh are still young and will get it in due course - so who do we give it to this time? Ah, Lee Mason hasn’t had it so let’s give it to him”
This line of thought wouldn’t have happened in the past as the quality was much higher in my opinion and sadly the likes of some of those mentioned earlier never got the prestigious chance to referee a final. I still maintain that Mason is fortunate to have got the final by virtue of age, length of service and lack of quality around
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QuoCob

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I don't see the issue with people questioning the appointment. It always seems odd to me when people go excessive on the congratulations for a final, as if they know the person or the person is likely to read it. If Simon Hooper is appointed to Chelsea V Spurs this weekend in the PL then no one is going to congratulate him but many would question it, so why should it be that much different for a final? In many ways, the more important the game, the more scrutiny there should be.

When Steve McClaren was appointed England manager, was no one allowed to qustion it because he'd been a manager for quite a few years and it was a big appointment for him?

For what it's worth, I have mixed feelings on the appointment. Lee Mason is an experienced PL referee and I think has had a solid season so it is reasonable that he should come under consideration. But equally I don't think it's wrong to question if he has been fortunate to spend 15 years or so as a PL referee or to ponder if this reflects an overall decline in the depth of refereeing at the top level.

I Don't Agree, A Cup final Is quite a big thing for a referee to get, (Yes I Know how undervalued the league cup is nowadays), why wouldn't you congratulate someone on it, Refs Generally work towards getting these appointments, it's not just a regular league game. Mason may have been poor in previous seasons, but he has in fairness to him been decent this season, it seems some aren't willing to give him any credit for that for some reason. he is getting this on merit this time.

But is that not the very point we are making. Is he getting this appointment “on merit”? He may have had a better season than most of his 15 years on the PL. However if this appointment is made on merit then I can think of a few refs who have never had the League Cup Final and have been better this season, so why on merit have they not been chosen? Is it not more of a case of “we have a dearth of refs capable - the likes of Tierney, Bankes, Kavanagh are still young and will get it in due course - so who do we give it to this time? Ah, Lee Mason hasn’t had it so let’s give it to him”
This line of thought wouldn’t have happened in the past as the quality was much higher in my opinion and sadly the likes of some of those mentioned earlier never got the prestigious chance to referee a final. I still maintain that Mason is fortunate to have got the final by virtue of age, length of service and lack of quality around

It happens in most County FA's across the country, with officials from Level 7 upwards, for the end of season prestigious matches?
Why should the SG1 organisation be any different? 
It's a 'top match' at SG1 level but all the matches within the County's are 'top matches' at their own levels and they will be appointed for many reasons, not just for being the 'best in class'.
“They shall grow not old as we that are left grow old:
Age shall not weary them, nor the years condemn.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning
We will remember them.”  Laurence Binyon
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Whistleblower

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I don't see the issue with people questioning the appointment. It always seems odd to me when people go excessive on the congratulations for a final, as if they know the person or the person is likely to read it. If Simon Hooper is appointed to Chelsea V Spurs this weekend in the PL then no one is going to congratulate him but many would question it, so why should it be that much different for a final? In many ways, the more important the game, the more scrutiny there should be.

When Steve McClaren was appointed England manager, was no one allowed to qustion it because he'd been a manager for quite a few years and it was a big appointment for him?

For what it's worth, I have mixed feelings on the appointment. Lee Mason is an experienced PL referee and I think has had a solid season so it is reasonable that he should come under consideration. But equally I don't think it's wrong to question if he has been fortunate to spend 15 years or so as a PL referee or to ponder if this reflects an overall decline in the depth of refereeing at the top level.

I Don't Agree, A Cup final Is quite a big thing for a referee to get, (Yes I Know how undervalued the league cup is nowadays), why wouldn't you congratulate someone on it, Refs Generally work towards getting these appointments, it's not just a regular league game. Mason may have been poor in previous seasons, but he has in fairness to him been decent this season, it seems some aren't willing to give him any credit for that for some reason. he is getting this on merit this time.

But is that not the very point we are making. Is he getting this appointment “on merit”? He may have had a better season than most of his 15 years on the PL. However if this appointment is made on merit then I can think of a few refs who have never had the League Cup Final and have been better this season, so why on merit have they not been chosen? Is it not more of a case of “we have a dearth of refs capable - the likes of Tierney, Bankes, Kavanagh are still young and will get it in due course - so who do we give it to this time? Ah, Lee Mason hasn’t had it so let’s give it to him”
This line of thought wouldn’t have happened in the past as the quality was much higher in my opinion and sadly the likes of some of those mentioned earlier never got the prestigious chance to referee a final. I still maintain that Mason is fortunate to have got the final by virtue of age, length of service and lack of quality around

I have no quibble with Mason getting the League Cup Final, I don't happen to think it is all that much of an honour and it has been decreasing over the years even from the time when it was regarded as the very inferior sibling to the FA Cup Final. I also don't object to giving a "showpiece" occasion to someone who has  striven hard and maintained a standard at a certain level for many years, at whatever level that is.  However, the old mantra of "it's given to the best official who hasn't previously had the honour" is clearly nonsense in my view. It may be given to the best long-serving official who hasn't previously received but not to the best, so it would be good if that truth was universally acknowledged.
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flipmode

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Very subjective views regarding the appropriateness and suitability of Lee Mason to officiate this final.
He is a Premier League official, has been for a number of years, has been considered to be in the top 21 officials in the country for some time performing to the standard required, which is better than most on here, who have worn the black shirt, will ever be.
He's eligible to officiate this final and 'his turn' is now, why are so many congratulating with questions and/or veiled criticism and comparing him with officials of yesteryear?  Their time was then, they didn't have the opportunity for a prestigious appointment for a number of reasons that are normally forgotten in time, Lee's time is now and he has earned his opportunity to receive the honour.

Well done for the appointment Lee Mason and team, hopefully you all enjoy the experience and have a good game.

Completely disagree with this. I too, have no qualms with Lee Mason getting the Final if it was awarded on merit alone. I don't think this happened in this instance though, and I could easily name at least five other officials who would be more deserving of this appointment if merit the sole contributing factor in the decision making process for this Cup Final appointment.
David Silva olé.
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rustyref

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Why, do you have access to the PGMOL observation marks from this season?
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